Autore Topic: [Spione] Giocare "in character"  (Letto 7301 volte)

Ezio

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Re:[Spione] Giocare "in character"
« Risposta #15 il: 2012-07-05 14:17:27 »
In my experience, the best games of Spione were quite a collective thing in which the reins of the story changed hands. With each change there was a clear pull in a certain direction but usually other cotributes were also accepted.


I totally agree with you, Claudia.

It just never occurred to me that I could lend it in this way ^^
Or maybe it occured to me, then I somehow forgot XD
Just because I give you advice it doesn't mean I know more than you, it just means I've done more stupid shit.

Moreno Roncucci

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Re:[Spione] Giocare "in character"
« Risposta #16 il: 2012-07-05 16:27:19 »
Hi Ezio!

I have to cherry-pick a couple of issues with your post...

Let's try like this.


The situation is Olga, controlled by Manuela with her Queen, me with the Ace, Lapo, Simone and Lavinia as the other player.

This is the first problem.

In Spione, Manuela doesn't control Olga. Everybody do.

The link between the Principal and "her" player is one of responsibility, not of control. Manuela has the responsibility to check that the other players play Olga with respect regarding what was already established, and with the Trespass (what happen during the game should not render the trespass unplayable). But if somebody during the Maneuvers phase play Olga adding to her background and making her react in a different way than the one Manuela would have chosen, Manuela's job is NOT to "correct" her.  She can, obviously, use her veto to refuse that addition to Olga's character, but if she do it in this case she is in effect "cheating", using an authority given to her for the sake of the game to "control" a character without sharing with the rest of the group.

There are no PCs in Spione. The two principals are more similar to NPC, but even that is a rough simplification. What they really are, is "characters in a story we are creating together".

This during the Maneuvers phase. During Flashpoints, Manuela WILL control Olga, because during flashpoints character advocacy get "reactivated", but this doesn't extend outside of the flashpoint phase.

Citazione
WHAT I KNOW I CAN DO AND DID

1: During my turn, with the apple in my hand, during Manouvers

I play a first-person dialogue saying: "So, the HVA agent, the Sgt. Muller, tells Olga: <<Your old handler betrayed you, all your ideals are crushed. I can offer you a new life, a new meaning>>. Olga shivers, but keeps her eyes on the eyes of the other spy: <<What I get from this deal?>>, she asks. Muller smiles: <<A new identity, a new work, and a dinner with me in one of the fanciest restaurant of West Berlin>>.

After this my turn is complete and I pass the narration to Manuela.

OK, you can, even if it's really contrived and lame having someone talk to himself for an entire dialog.  I really suggest in these cases to use a very short third-person narration (I know that you already know this, but I don't want anybody reading this thinking that talking with himself is a good idea in Spione)

Citazione
2: During my turn, with the apple in my hand, during Manouvers.

I play part of a first-person dialogue saying: "So, the HVA agent, the Sgt. Muller, tells Olga: <<Your old handler betrayed you, all your ideals are crushed. I can offer you a new life, a new meaning>>"

After this my turn is complete and I pass the narration to Manuela.

Manuela continues the previous dialogue, providing an answer for Olga and she says: "Olga shivers, but keeps her eyes on the eyes of the other spy: <<What I get from this deal?>> she asks."

After this Manuela pass the turn. We go quickly through Lapo, Manuela and Simone who add quick strokes of colour narration or details on the other Spy. It's my turn again.

I can end the dialogue and say: "Muller smiles: <<A new identity, a new work, and a dinner with me in one of the fanciest restaurant of West Berlin>>"

I pass my turn, it is Manuela turn again.

Lapo, and Simone (why did you list Manuela again?) are NOT limited to color narration.  One of them could have said that a superior of Sgt Muller enter the room. Or he could even have continued the dialog for sgt Muller, saying something completely different from what you would have said.

Now, if they see you having something very specific in mind for Sgt Muller, it would be very poor form for them to cut you out. When this happen in game (and it happened in our first sessions) the effect is having the guy next time keep hold of the apple until the other players have to physically pry open his fingers to get him to let it go. Don't do it, you should be open to say "yes" to each other's addition but don't begin to fight for control. Don't hog the spotlight, don't force you vision undercutting other people's ideas. Spione is very easy for this, because you always have two narration to add to, at any single time: if Lapo in this example don't want to limit himself to add only color, but at the same time he see that you have something very specific in mind, he can always add to the OTHER narration, the one of the other principal.

But the point is that he doesn't HAVE to. He can play sgt Muller, he can play Olga, adding all the content that he want. He can have Olga jump from the window (going directly into flashpoint). You don't have control of Sgt Muller when you don't have the apple, and Manuela doesn't have control of Olga when she doesn't have the Apple. (she has vero power ONLY. She can say "no, she would not do this", but she CAN'T say to Lapo what she would do instead. It's Lapo who say what Olga does, after his first action gets vetoed.  Manuela has not control of Olga when she doesn't have the apple. she has a responsibility to check other people's use of control)

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WHAT I DON'T KNOW IF I CAN DO

During my turn, with the apple in my hand, during Manouvers

I play part of a first-person dialogue saying: "So, the HVA agent, the Sgt. Muller, tells Olga: <<Your old handler betrayed you, all your ideals are crushed. I can offer you a new life, a new meaning>>"


Now Manuela, acting as Olfa says: "Olga shivers, but keeps her eyes on the eyes of the other spy: <<What I get from this deal?>> she asks."

I look at Manuela, with half a smile and say: "Muller smiles: <<A new identity, a new work, and a dinner with me in one of the fanciest restaurant of West Berlin>>"


NOW my turn is complete and I pass the narration to Manuela.




Moreno, I believe you have already answered to this, as my latter example is similar to your- Am I correct?

Yes, this is perfectly allowed by the rules.

Notice that you could have asked Lapo to play Olga, not Manuela. Manuela has not the control of Olga.  Now, I have always seen the principal assigned to the principal's player in these cases, but it's a matter of convenience (you have a player with veto power over a character, it's simpler to let him play that character), not a rule.

But I urge you to consider giving the apple away after the first line of dialog. Make it move around, quickly. It's terrifying at first, but when you get the hang of it, it's fantastic.
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Ezio

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Re:[Spione] Giocare "in character"
« Risposta #17 il: 2012-07-05 19:47:51 »
Moreno, I'm not terrified by that, you know me. I just interpreted the rules (now it's evident) in a stricter sense than they was.


You are nottrusting me and you are forgotting all the games we played together. Do I seem to you the kind of player who is afraid of letting go his authority? ;-)


In Spione, Manuela doesn't control Olga. Everybody do.

I know, don't worry. I'm writing in a language that isn't mine and I don't know the english terms of the games. I knew it already in the Italian edition, so I'm forced to use turns of phrases and the likes.
I know and I've experience with the sharing of a Spione character ^^


OK, you can, even if it's really contrived and lame having someone talk to himself for an entire dialog.  I really suggest in these cases to use a very short third-person narration (I know that you already know this, but I don't want anybody reading this thinking that talking with himself is a good idea in Spione)

Yes, I already know. My advice is to use indirect language, here ^^


Lapo, and Simone (why did you list Manuela again?) are NOT limited to color narration.  One of them could have said that a superior of Sgt Muller enter the room. Or he could even have continued the dialog for sgt Muller, saying something completely different from what you would have said.

I know. I semplified for the sake of the example ^^
Just because I give you advice it doesn't mean I know more than you, it just means I've done more stupid shit.

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